Inside the Mind of an Office Manager - Delegation

Bethany’s sister-in-law is back!! Amanda has been a manager for many years now. She recalls a time when she felt, “If I want to have something done right, I have to do it myself.” This mindset led her to burnout, fatigue, and frustration. She and Bethany discuss her delegation mindset. Amanda shares how she strives to create a collaborative environment where delegation, teamwork, and equality is the norm. She also shares her mindset when hiring and managing team members. There are so many wonderful nuggets of advice in this episode. Don’t miss it! 

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Transcript

0:01
Are you looking for a podcast where you can hear from real [music] people regarding their real dental drama? If

0:08
so, then you've come to the right place. Join hosts [music] Bethany Penny and Dr. Reena Kuba as we

0:15
dive into the solutions we've created [music] and the mistakes we've made while managing dental drama.

0:22
Let's get started. Amanda, welcome back. Hey, how are you? We were just talking. It's been like 3

0:29
years since you've been on the show. Too long. Too long. What's wrong with me? [laughter] Why don't I bring the mic

0:35
every time I come home? So, just so listeners know, Amanda is my

0:41
sister-in-law. For how many years now have we been linked together?

0:46
Oh, goodness. Uh, well, Brent and I got married in 2009. So,

0:52
gosh, a long time. A long time. We've put up with this family for far too long.

0:59
I love it. I wouldn't trade it for the world. Oh my goodness. So, Amanda and I go back all the way to 2009, but you didn't join

1:05
dad's practice until what year did you come on board? I was actually working for him before we

1:13
got married. So, I think I started with him in 2007.

1:18
Okay. Because I left Dad's practice. For listeners, I worked with dad's practice

1:24
until I think it was right before you came on. Yes. I spun off and you

1:29
Mhm. came in and took over, swooped in and just said, "I reap the benefits [laughter] of

1:35
everything you had already had in place." Shoot, girl. No, you came in and did your thing. [laughter] So, um, but

1:42
before that, you were in legal, right? Yes. I worked for a couple of lawyers in

1:48
Little Rock. Um, one was a defense attorney. Yeah. And one was just did

1:54
divorces and family law, things like that. So, and then you said, "Let's do dental." Yeah. Why not? Total complete change of

2:03
scenery. I mean, and [laughter] then fast forward and you're still in it. Yes. Still managing. Still getting to work

2:10
with my dad every day, your father-in-law, and which that's a whole dynamic that we've never even talked

2:15
about, but That's such a blessing, too. I know. I love it. You get to be with him every day. That's pretty good.

2:20
And still learning something new every day. Yeah. [laughter] Yeah. So, I think I

2:26
told you this after we dropped Amanda's first episode in I think it was January

2:31
of 2023. We were just remembering that we recorded on your birthday [laughter] because that's the kind of sis we rely

2:37
on like, "Hey, can you talk to us on your birthday?" Um, and then dropped it in January 2023 and it was immediately

2:45
like one of our top episodes. Oh. because people wanted to hear from a manager. And then I had one of the

2:50
managers that I was working with at the time. She was like, "Can you please have Amanda back?" And then look at me. Here

2:56
we are. Yes. Yes. In a few years. [laughter]

3:01
But I do have a really hard topic for you today. So Dr. Coop and I have been talking a

3:07
lot about how practice owners, managers, like they can't do it all on their own.

3:13
like they have to be able to delegate out. But then half the problem is you delegate out and then how can you ensure

3:21
that what you've delegated out is getting done? You know, is it just as hard to follow up and correct people or

3:29
hold people accountable? And so I thought about you today and I'm like this is a perfect topic for you because as a manager you can't do every job in

3:36
the practice. No, you can't. Absolutely. You got to be able to to pass stuff off.

3:41
And so I wanted to get your strategy from a manager's perspective on how do

3:47
you h first of all how do you decide what to delegate? How do you pick who to

3:53
delegate to? Do you base that on talent? Base that on just like this is your job

4:00
description. You got to do it. So tell me a little bit about how you go through that process. Right. So um I feel like a huge thanks

4:06
to you. Whenever I entered the practice, we had like owners like the insurance

4:12
coordinator and the finance coordinator and things like that. So really like you

4:18
had this niche topic in dentistry that was your sole focus. Yes, you need to

4:24
know how to do everything, but this is going to be what you do day in and day

4:30
out. You're going to be the expert of this topic. So

4:36
like with I think proper training first and for first and foremost um well back

4:43
that up a little bit finding the right fit and somebody because the old cliche good health is hard to find is very true

4:50
and accurate. Yes. However, um if you can find that person and they're hungry and they want

4:55
to learn and somebody with dental background is a plus, but not necessary all the time because you can train that

5:02
if you have the patience and you know the time, right? Because you don't learn

5:08
it overnight. So like my insurance coordinator, she is

5:13
going to enter all of those insurance plans, make sure that we have the correct fee schedule. She's going to

5:19
ensure that my treatment coordinator can present an accurateish enough

5:26
treatment plan cuz right it's just an estimate [laughter] but but we do try our best um to get

5:33
those accurate numbers for patients because nobody likes surprises especially financial surprises. So

5:41
that being you know number one just having somebody that can own

5:47
it. Yeah, own that and just having everybody in your practice have that business owner

5:52
mindset where they want to do it correctly. Um, but I think also in the

5:59
beginning and even now like people still mess up. You have to have a little bit

6:05
of leeway and you know just say you know what that's okay and if everything can

6:11
usually be fixed if as long as it's not like a huge hippo violation or something like that then that's a whole another

6:16
podcast. But yeah, [laughter] um you're like that can be Yeah, that that might be an issue. Um

6:23
but yeah, so just I think having patience and just understanding and having your

6:30
people know also that you're going to have their back. Um, and even whenever you do have to correct them, just them

6:38
knowing what your intentions are and that you care about them growing in

6:45
their position and that it's not necessarily a bad thing and we can get we can overcome this. It's not, like I

6:52
said, it's not life or death. Exactly. It's nothing that can't be fixed and hopefully they learn from it

6:57
the first time and it's not a mistake that keeps being repeated cuz then again

7:02
that's another podcast too [laughter] like Hippa and people that go crazy.

7:08
We'll talk about that differently. [laughter] So then have you had somebody in the

7:13
past where you're like okay I need her to fill this role. This is going to be her specialty. And did you at some point

7:21
did you realize she's not getting it? Like I don't know that I can be patient long enough for

7:28
her to get it. And can you tell if you've had that? Can you tell us about that? Absolutely. So everybody's different,

7:35
but in my practice, um I typically don't mind to hire people with no dental

7:41
background because I feel like it's hard to untrain some things that have already been learned. So if I can train them up

7:47
from the beginning, then it could be more beneficial to me. Now the struggle with learning dentistry is is there

7:54
tenfold with that aspect of it. But I always have the rule of thumb that I

7:59
give them a year, okay, to learn dentistry. And I feel like that's fair. I look back whenever I

8:05
first started, I'd had no dental background. And I asked some of my co-workers at the time, like whenever we hire new people,

8:12
I'm like, "Did it take me this long to learn it?" and they were like, "No." I'm like, "Okay, good. I just got to have

8:17
this like reference, you know, um to see what I'm dealing with." Because

8:23
for instance, we had an insurance coordinator retiring out of the practice. And so I thought, you know

8:30
what, it would be really good. We had a heads up. We knew that we were transitioning this role. and we hired

8:37
somebody to train with her until she was ready to step out of of her role and fully

8:44
retire. And she kept saying, "You know, Amanda, I just I just don't think she's

8:49
going to get it. I just don't think she's got it." And this was even 6 months into her training.

8:55
Wow. And I said, "You know what? I really like her. I She's got a good

9:01
attitude. She's got a good work ethic. I'm going to keep her and I'm going to give her a shot still.

9:08
Fast forward, this team member retires

9:13
and we transition the new hire into her role full-time with no help.

9:19
Yeah. You know, no nobody to fall back on and say, "Hey, I have She is so valuable to me. Like, she is

9:27
one of my go-to people now." And I'm so glad that I gave her a shot and I and I,

9:33
you know, just stuck it out because, you know, you can make those decisions

9:38
earlier on and say, you know what, I've got to cut ties. But I think that deep down, you know, if somebody has a good

9:45
work ethic and they're willing to learn new things and they can retain that and you see

9:51
that and they're not continually making the same mistakes or asking, "What did

9:56
you say again?" or "How do I do this again?" the very next day after you just went over that. Um,

10:04
then I think that that's a telltale sign that you can you have somebody that you can work with. You have potential.

10:10
Yeah. And so that's I don't know if I I think that's a great example. And I'm

10:15
glad you said the timeline, too, though, because I do think a lot of people give up too early on team members,

10:22
even if they're even if they've got prior dental background. It's like we want them up and ready to go by 6 weeks

10:29
in. And that's a really hard especially if you're undoing dentistry from some

10:34
other office. It's like you need 6 weeks just to undo and then to have a good

10:39
solid, you know, year up to a year where you're like, "Okay, I'm willing to give this person a chance." Unless that work

10:45
ethic's not there or a poor attitude or something like that that would shorten that timeline. But I think we're not

10:51
patient enough to really let people and I struggle with that too. I struggle

10:57
with patience and I get frustrated. But I think, you know, just stepping out and just taking a deep breath and saying,

11:03
you know what, I was there once, too. You've been through this before.

11:09
You know, just have a conversation with that team member and check in with them. You know, like it doesn't have to be a

11:15
six-month review or a year review. just check in with them and say, "Hey, how do you feel like this is going?

11:22
What do you need from me?" Yeah. To be able to do your role better because like, you know, and they might

11:28
bring to you some things that you've noticed and that you were really wanting to talk about. Yeah. But it comes,

11:34
you know, from them instead. And so, um, I think that part of that is just them being aware, you being aware, keep your

11:42
doctor informed. Communication is so key. in every aspect. I think that

11:49
everybody just needs to know what's going on and you have to have communication between doctor and team

11:55
member and if there's any other, you know, leader, if you're going to be out

12:00
as a practice manager that can take on that role and kind of help lead the other people while you're out

12:07
Yeah. then just communicate. Yeah. And just let everybody know what's going

12:12
on. I have a very open door policy. I don't have an office in my office. So

12:18
whenever you need to come talk to me, come talk to me. If you need to come talk to me in private, we can go somewhere private.

12:23
But then like I'm going to ask you, can I share this with other people? Because we all learn from each other.

12:30
So yeah, I think you also make a good point though with you are the design of dad's

12:38
office was there. There really was not ever a private office in there. Well,

12:45
dad had one for a little bit, which got taken away. [laughter] Um, we needed more ops,

12:51
which is such a good thing, which means he lost his [laughter] office. Um, but there was never a quote unquote

12:57
manager's office. And I do think that's part of you being able to stay in touch

13:03
with your team because you're right there in the line of fire all over the

13:08
office wherever you're needed. Absolutely. 100%. I would very much so encourage managers not to have an

13:16
office. I know that sounds crazy um because you feel like, oh well, I have to, you know, get these reports done and

13:22
this and that. It's doable. It's still doable. Um, but being in the mix like

13:28
you said and knowing and hearing everything, hearing conversations between patients, being able to step up

13:35
and go to the back. I'll still go to the back and I'll turn over rooms. I'll run

13:41
instruments, you know, and things like and I think that that also builds trust with your team and they know that you're

13:47
going to be there to help them out. Whereas to if you are in an office and you know maybe you have the door closed,

13:54
you're not going to know when your team needs you, you're not going to be able to hear those overhear those conversations and be able to coach on

14:01
that. Like if if something like if a patient was upset at the front desk, maybe you need to intervene or maybe

14:08
it's something where you can just listen in and then coach on that after the patient leaves and say, "How

14:15
do you think that went? What could you have done better? do you want some feedback? You know, and

14:20
and just say, "Well, I have some ideas and maybe this is what we could do next time or something like that."

14:26
But you wouldn't get that opportunity to your point if you're tucked away or not overhearing that, right?

14:31
And I think that actually ties into delegation as well because if you're asking a team member to take on a task

14:38
for you, they know you're not tucked away in this office doing who knows

14:43
what. You're out with them all over the practice. you're one of them. So that

14:49
when you pass something off or when you give that feedback, it's coming across not from this high and mighty place of

14:55
she's in her office. What does she know? But like she's one of us, she's with us.

15:00
And and I'm not above doing anything that I would ask them to do, right? Either. Um, so like if I have,

15:09
I don't know, extra checks to post or something like that that I'm just like really overwhelmed with something or

15:16
like I said, I'm out of the office. Um, I know that I have a couple of team members, a couple business assistants

15:23
that I can say, "Hey, while I'm out, I need you to do this or um, you know, we

15:29
have ex so many there's five treatment plans being called for right now. I'll go do one. can you go do one, you know,

15:36
another team member can do another one just so that they're not waiting on the one person that does treatment plans

15:42
because there's only one person that can do treatment plans or something like that. But also, I can remember whenever I was

15:48
the only one that did treatment plans and you know, although it worked but it

15:54
didn't work, you know, still stressful. Yes, it was stressful. patients were waiting and then doctor starts running

16:01
behind or something like that just because they're waiting or we're converting treatment which is also not a

16:06
bad thing. It's a good thing to convert treatment and say yes same day but um sometimes it can cause

16:14
a what what's the word I'm looking for like like a frenzy a frenzy. Yes. Everybody's running

16:19
around like how are we going to take care of this patient? Oh, are we going to run behind now? But it's just all

16:24
hands on deck all the time. Yeah. And I'm so fortunate in my office

16:29
too that I don't really have any team members where if I asked them to do

16:35
something that they would either one not know how to do it or one say no I'm too

16:40
busy or that's not my job right because everybody knows in my office

16:47
that not my job or those are the no no words you know like you do not say that

16:53
is not my job because then we're going to have a really serious closed door conversation because

16:59
it's everybody's job. We're all a team and we're all here to take care of each other. You know, I know it sounds like

17:04
crazy, but like we all love each other and we're going to take care of each other and we're going to help each other out. Yeah. And setting that expectation early

17:12
and knowing there's a severe consequence if you act like something is not your job or heaven forbid say that's not your

17:18
job. Like that doesn't fit with our culture. Exactly. [clears throat] Yeah. No, absolutely not. Yeah. So,

17:24
and that again goes to making it easier to delegate cuz it's like, yeah, you

17:29
might give somebody a task and you might take a task too because again, y'all are

17:34
all helping each other out. Absolutely. It's whoever has that downtime that can say, "Hey, I I've got this."

17:41
Yeah. Or we have hygienists that go over and numb for doctor if [clears throat] he's running behind. I have dental assistants

17:49
that will come to the front whenever there's two or three girls going to run and do treatment plans to help answer

17:55
phones. Yeah. Because they know that we're in with their patients right now, so they're

18:00
going to come up to the front. And I can remember whenever I first started, there was such

18:07
a like front versus back culture. Yeah. And I'm so glad that that is not the

18:13
case anymore. It is completely gone. And I love it because it was always like,

18:19
well, we do this and this and this and we're so busy and you know, and then it was like the front would be like, well,

18:26
you have no idea what we do up here and what we're dealing with patients. And I'm just like, you know what? Everybody

18:31
deals with everybody everything. Like, it's okay. We all have our struggles and

18:37
it's not like we're dealing with more than you're dealing with. Like, let's just help each other out.

18:42
Yeah. Yeah. We're all in it together. And I honestly think that sometimes the frenzied moments forces that to happen.

18:50
Yes. Where it's like we don't have time to think in that frenzy of activity of is this my job or is this her job. It's

18:56
just like we got to get through. We got to get it done and we have to take care of this patient because the patient is the number one focus.

19:02
Yeah. Yeah. Which again breaks down those walls of like no, we're literally all in this

19:07
together. And I think you make a good point too. If a business team member has stepped in with that patient, then in

19:13
theory that RDA has a moment. If they're in there talking, if our business team

19:18
members talking for a couple minutes over that treatment plan, then that RDA has a couple minutes. Why not swap

19:24
places? Do you remember the old show uh wife swap? Yes. [laughter] Yeah.

19:29
It's like, let's just wife swap. Even if it's for two or three minutes here and there, it's like live a moment in the other person's shoes and then you have a

19:36
perspective that's super helpful. Well, one of the very very first things I learned in dentistry um thanks to your

19:43
dad, my doctor, was there is always something to do. Yeah. [laughter]

19:50
Learned that very fast. And you know what? He is not wrong. So, and I have

19:56
kept that mentality for the last 18 years. [laughter] What is downtime? There's no such thing

20:01
as downtime. You've got downtime. Something's wrong with you, right? It's like you are not doing

20:08
something that is supposed to be done right now if you have downtime. [laughter] It is so true. Yeah. He lives life and

20:16
work that way, doesn't he? Yes. Yeah. Absolutely. It's the same on and off the field. And

20:21
that's what I was going to say too about those like frenzied moments is like some people thrive in those moments too, you know? And it's

20:29
like I can think like with my mom and just I don't know if it's hereditary or

20:35
if it's a learned behavior, but it's like whenever things get crazy, it's like you focus in, you are honed in and

20:41
you are ready to take care of business. You know, you are going to get it done and you're going to be timely and

20:47
everybody's going to be happy and it's going to be correct. [laughter] That's so true. [gasps]

20:54
Oh goodness. Sometimes it's too too slow, too planned. Even though

20:59
internally we may want that control to just have this smooth even kill. But

21:06
sometimes we function our best when it's like no, it's go time. Yeah, let's do this.

21:12
And I would much rather have that too because it just makes the day go by so much faster. And if you're just slow and

21:17
you're like, you know, nobody really wants to have to call patients to come in for treatment. You know, that's like

21:22
the most boring part of the job. Like you want to like be taking care of patients that are in the office right

21:27
now and like have them scheduled back. So just following all the processes also to have patients come back and

21:34
Yeah. keep their scheduled appointments. Yes. Yes. So keep it busy and then we're all

21:39
functioning. Exactly. Everybody's happy. Yeah. Yes. [laughter] Well, then on that note, how then do you get to because I

21:46
know y'all y'all run an incredibly busy practice. So, how do you get to then

21:51
quote unquote your tasks, your management tasks if every day is pretty much pumping and going? How do you find

21:59
space? Oh, goodness. Well, there's no set schedule. Yeah. Like you fit it in where you can get it

22:05
in, you know? Yeah. um because you know from the jump the schedule that you

22:11
start out with during the in the morning is not going to be what you end with. And so I think just having that

22:17
flexibility and willingness to just go with the flow type of thing and just to

22:24
know that it's going to get done. You're going to get it done. And worst case scenario,

22:30
if I'm on a time crunch and I've got a due date and I have to get some things

22:35
done and we are just slammed, I know that I can tell my team, hey, I have to

22:42
get this submitted. I have to get this report in. I have to, you know, get this report to an insurance company or my

22:49
manager or whatever. Um, they're going to be understanding and they're going to be like, you know what, we've got this.

22:54
you you get that done and because they know that it's important too. Yeah. So, I think I'm just really blessed.

23:01
Yeah. With a good team. Like they are literally like my family. They're my work family.

23:06
Yeah. And we all get along and like I don't know like a couple weekends ago we all went out on the boat, you know? Like

23:13
it's just we work together but we still hang out together outside of work too.

23:18
Yeah. a good relationship where it's like, okay, we we really do genuinely like each other and enjoy each other.

23:25
Exactly. Yeah. And then you're willing to do things for people that you like and enjoy.

23:30
Exactly. Yeah. It's like it's it doesn't annoy me if she asks for help because I like her and

23:36
I want to help her out. That is such a good point because I have had the opposite of that before and I

23:42
know the feeling of you just don't want to do anything nice for a person because you just don't like them. And that's not a good feeling.

23:49
No. No. So, I think just, you know, like I said in the beginning, just hiring the right people, making sure that they know what

23:55
your culture is like um from the interview process. Yeah. And saying like, is this going to be

24:01
something that you can live with that you can work with, you know, like getting to know somebody? It's hard to

24:06
get to know somebody and 30 minutes. I know. You know, um but those are that's what

24:12
you're working with. Yeah. To make a hiring decision. So, it's it's hard. It doesn't always work out, but

24:18
when it does, it's really great. It's really nice. And it leads to again good team atmosphere, like shared

24:24
workload. But I do think too, like hiring is part of it, like bringing the right people

24:30
on, making sure you talk about your culture early on, lead out in that culture, but also I think you in

24:37
particular fostering that environment that you want. Like it's not just you

24:42
talking about culture, it's you trying to live out that culture, too. that then tells people like, "Oh, no, she she

24:49
means what she says." And Yeah, absolutely. So, like, you know,

24:54
we're we're in an office with a bunch of girls. There's like 12 of us. Um, which I know isn't huge. There's a

25:01
lot larger practices out there, but I think everybody knows I don't do Mean

25:06
Girl vibes. Yeah. Um, so anytime that I would even

25:14
remotely hear a whisper of something, I'm going to shut it down. Yeah. You know, um, and I think that too, my

25:22
team knows that if they have a problem first and foremost, I've really

25:27
encouraged people to work it out amongst themselves before they come to me. Um, I I don't want to be a mediator, but I

25:33
will if I have to. Yeah. But also you everybody knows that we

25:40
have the best intentions for each other. So if you guys have an issue with each other, try to work it out amongst

25:46
yourselves first. And if you can't come and get me and then we'll really dive into what's going

25:52
on because there's something larger at play. Yeah. probably figure it out on your own then

25:57
it's so and and you know in the beginning ask permission like do I have your

26:03
permission to be honest and upfront with you can I come to you if I have a

26:08
problem with something that you've done or can I be honest with you um open that door for them that way they

26:15
know oh maybe something big is coming and they can kind of be mentally prepared for that cuz I have had people

26:21
be defensive before um But again, not to harp on this too

26:26
bad, but as long as they know where you're coming from. Yeah. I think that it lands a lot softer.

26:32
Yeah. So, because I can be a little direct sometimes and a little brass, but I

26:39
think that hopefully my team knows that deep down I love them. I want what's best for

26:45
them. And if it's not going to be a good fit anymore, then you know what? We might

26:51
part ways, but I'm still gonna want what's best for you. Right. So, if you ever need anything in the

26:57
future, I'm still here for you. Yeah. Um and things like that. Just fostering that relationship and that culture.

27:03
Yeah. I think that foundation is really important because then, like you said, that covers kind of a multitude of

27:09
miscommunications or anything as long as people understand the intention is

27:14
care and miscommunications happen. Yeah. And just ask for clarity. Yeah. You know, again, that

27:20
communication, ask questions, right? Get clarification if you need it. Um, or

27:26
if you maybe somebody did misunderstand what you meant and so they're implementing something in a way that you

27:31
didn't really intend for that to happen, just correct it, you know, and just say,

27:37
"Hey, you know, like I'm sorry if I described that wrong or or there was

27:42
something a miss in the communication that that we in the conversation we had,

27:47
but this is what I wanted you to do. I noticed that it was it happened this

27:52
way. Can it can we change it or whatever? I don't know what the circumstance would be, but

27:58
let's get back to the way that I intended it and just doing it like you said, that's where it takes that directness to go, hey, hey, I noticed

28:05
this. I wanted it to be done this way. Like, can we get back to doing it this way? And I think just addressing it

28:11
directly is the only way that you can there's, like you said, the mean girl. There's no reason to complain about how

28:17
it's being done wrong to anybody else. It's like go straight to the source, correct it, and say, "Hey, it needs to

28:22
be done this way." Yeah. And there's I don't feel like that there's

28:28
ever really like just one right way to do something. Um I was having a conversation with a a group of people I

28:36
was teaching a class for last week and somebody said, "Well, if you want it

28:41
done the right way, you've got to do it yourself." And I was like, "You know what? I used to have that mentality, but I realized that there is more than one

28:48
right way to do something. Yeah. Potentially now that's very like, you

28:54
know, like don't don't run with that because like you have to submit

28:59
insuranceances on certain claims. You have to, you know, like there is one right way to do that. But I feel like

29:05
also like if there's trial and error with things, if it's something new that you're trying to implement,

29:12
have a little bit of grace. Yeah. you know, see if something works out that way and then if it doesn't say,

29:18
"Okay, well, we need to change it." So, I don't always have the best ideas, right? And I I'm willing to admit that. So, if

29:25
I want something implemented and I ask somebody to do it a certain way, and it's not done that way, but it still

29:32
gets a the same result or a better result, I'm going to say, "Well, you know what? Maybe that way is better."

29:38
Yeah. And let's do it that way from now on or something like that. So, I don't think

29:43
that it's my way or the highway or that my word is the end all beall and I am

29:49
just the dental goddess and I have all of the knowledge and everything and I know exactly how to do everything

29:55
correctly. But I think that I'm willing and open to still learn every day and I

30:03
am still willing and open to have feedback from my team as well. Yeah. which I think is important because

30:08
if you're in the place of really consistently having to give both positive feedback and hey, can I give

30:14
you a suggestion here? Can we try it differently? You've got to be just as much open to that same feedback for

30:19
yourself. Absolutely. Because you know what? Your team has to be happy, too. And if they're in misery with something that

30:24
you're trying to implement because it's not working, they're the ones really truly implementing it with the patients.

30:31
And so you need that feedback, too. and then tweak it, change it, listen to them,

30:38
you know, like nobody wants to work in misery every day, right? So, Right. And I like that perspective, too,

30:44
because I think that's one of the questions that Dr. Kuba asked me about delegating. She was like, well, what if

30:50
it's not done in the way that I wanted it to be done? And I think you make a

30:56
good point that sometimes before we just immediately go ah don't do it that way

31:01
do it this way to sit back and evaluate and go okay did it achieve the result that I wanted it to achieve and or did

31:09
it get better results and if so am I willing to consider that that may be a better path and the answer may still be

31:15
no it may still be like no it didn't get the results that I needed or wanted and so I have to correct it now but having

31:21
that moment of pause to go let me make sure that It's actually not a better way of doing it. Absolutely.

31:27
Yeah. Yeah. So, I think that's a great suggestion as well. I had another question as you were sitting there talking about um

31:36
you said in the class you mentioned oh that somebody had said if you want anything done right, you've got to do it

31:42
yourself. And um I totally get that mindset. And I know every manager out

31:48
there can probably sympathize with a moment like that. But in addition to encouraging them to consider like, hey,

31:55
could there be a different way for it? I think also that mindset is going to lead

32:00
to burnout. Oh yes. Right. Yes. Cuz that, like I said, that used to

32:06
be my mindset. Yeah. Um and then I had somebody come in and

32:12
they were, you know, training us and she said to me, she said, "Amanda, if you

32:18
don't delegate some task, you are just going to be worn out every

32:23
single day." And my response was, "Well, if I want something done right, I've got to do it myself." [laughter]

32:29
And so, um, but I said, "You know what? I'm going to give it a shot." Yeah. And I have to learn how to trust

32:36
my team. Yeah. So, that was something that I really had to overcome within myself. And I'm so

32:41
glad that I did because I'm so much happier now because I really was going home just like every day like I was

32:47
exhausted or I was completely stressed out about some events that happened.

32:53
Um, but you know what? Sometimes now, even if there's a disgruntled patient

32:58
and they call on the phone, if I know that one of my team members answered it,

33:04
I'm going to let them try to handle it first. like it doesn't always have to come directly to me. Now, if they

33:09
haven't been able to resolve the situation or make the patient happy in the end and come to a conclusion that,

33:16
you know, makes everybody happy, then I'll say, you know, go ahead and transfer it to me or let me give them a

33:22
call back or something like that. But I think trust with your team Yeah. is huge with delegating because

33:30
you just have to, you know, let them do it and let them learn and let them make mistakes.

33:36
Yeah. And then they're going to get it and then they're going to become experts at it, too. And then that's one thing

33:41
completely off your plate, you know, and be like, you know what, you can just take over take that over

33:47
indefinitely. I don't have to just delegate it to you every now and then. Like, you know what? That's yours.

33:53
You [laughter] did so good. You have it forever now. Yeah. You did so good. I'm just That is

33:59
yours. Release that until forever. [laughter]

34:05
Don't give it back. Thank you very much. It's true. But you would never get to that if you didn't try. And I think you

34:11
you've got to have that trust. And I think trust knowing that they're going to make mistakes in the process of

34:17
taking that over. And as long as you're geared up for that and you're like, "Hey, mistakes are normal. That's how they're going to

34:23
learn this task." Yes. Then you won't feel the urge to take it back. Yes. And sometimes you might still feel

34:29
the urge to take it back. Refrain. [laughter] You know, just coach, coach, coach,

34:35
coach. And encouraging words, words of affirmation, the love language is, you

34:41
know, just say, you know what, you've got this. I believe in you. You're like, don't let this one mistake discourage

34:46
you. Try it again. Yeah. you know, and just I think you having faith in your team member gives

34:53
them so much more just encouragement to

34:58
say, you know what, I'm going to give it another shot. You know what? I can learn this. I can do this. And I can become

35:04
the expert at it, too. Yeah. So, cuz again, going back to my glory days, I was the treatment coordinator. I

35:11
was the one that did all of the treatment plans. And now really my go-to girl, Melissa,

35:18
she's the one that does all of the treatment plans and she's the one that gets all the yeses and everything. And sometimes I'm like, you know what, let

35:24
me do that treatment plan. [laughter] I want to go back there. Um, but yeah,

35:30
it's just and that's such a great feeling, too, you know, that you're like, man,

35:35
I trained her, you know, I did that. I did that. Look at [laughter] her go. She did that, too. like she wouldn't be

35:41
there without like her her commitment to her her

35:48
craft. Yeah. But um and just really like her drive to get that patient to say yes

35:55
too. Like I think it's almost a challenge for her and getting and I being able to identify

36:02
that too as a manager for the people that are more timid opposed to more

36:07
competitive. Yeah. and knowing who you can delegate those t tasks to. Uh that's it's just

36:14
really enjoyable to see it come to fruition. Yeah. Fion. This full this full picture

36:20
of like, hey, I saw that in her. I trained her in that. She started to take it over and now look at her

36:26
and now she's better than me. [laughter] Now I got to go prove myself that I can

36:31
still do that, you know. No, just kidding. which is like, [laughter] but that's a testament of again a good coach, somebody that's been

36:38
pouring into that team member. So, it's like you you can still wear it proudly as yours, [laughter]

36:43
partly yours anyway. Oh, that's so funny. Like, I lit the match and she she just

36:50
Yeah. But again, to me, that's success because for a manager, you can't be the treatment coordinator, the insurance

36:56
coordinator, the hygiene coordinator, the check-in, checkout coordin like you cannot do that. And the fact of the

37:02
matter is, you have to grow your people. Yeah. And you're only going to grow them by delegating tasks to them and giving them

37:10
an extra thing to handle. I wouldn't say delegate 20 tasks to them at once that they've never done before. Yeah.

37:17
You know, and not everything is going to be brand new too that you have to delegate out. Yeah. Like sometimes you can just be

37:22
overwhelmed and you say, you know what, you know, I know that this isn't something that you normally do. You've done it before. Do this again. You know,

37:30
or something like that. But like yeah once you train somebody on a certain

37:35
task in the office and they get that then it is really good feeling. Yeah. Yeah. And you can be just as proud

37:42
as they are. Oh like yes that's such a and people want to feel successful. They

37:48
can't feel successful if we don't allow them to take on tasks and to try things. And so we do have to take a little bit

37:54
of a leap of faith and go I know they can do this. And that too, you have to keep in mind that your team members,

38:01
they want to feel like they're needed. They want to feel like they're contributing to the office. They want to

38:09
they want to grow. Yeah. And if they don't want to grow, that's another conversation. That's a different

38:15
podcast. [laughter] I'm just kidding. But but yeah, like um you know,

38:21
[clears throat] and it's really encouraging too whenever you have those team members also coming up to ask you

38:27
after you've delegated something to them or one or two things and they're say, "Hey, do you have anything else that I

38:32
can do for you?" Yes. And then you're like, "Wow, [laughter] okay. This is nice." You know,

38:39
yeah. As a matter of fact, [laughter] here's this binder. No, I'm just kidding.

38:45
But yeah, I love it. And I love that they're hungry and that they want to grow. Yeah. And I feel like I have that with all of

38:52
my team members, which is I'm fortunate for that as well. Yeah. Well, and I think to your point, when they feel success and they're like,

38:58
"That felt good and now I want more and they're coming to you, like we need to have additional things that we can pass

39:05
to them." Absolutely. Um I remember a parenting book I read early on. Um it was this lady that was

39:12
trying to raise like helpful kids and and she was like, "Well, well, how can kids learn to be helpful if every time

39:19
they ask, "Hey, mom, do you need help?" You're like, "No, I got this. No, I got this. No, I got this." And she made the

39:25
point. She was like, "As parents, like it's so much easier for us to just cook the meal and be done with it." And it's

39:31
so much slower and harder to have your kids step in and help you with that meal. But that's how they learn to help. And I

39:38
was like, "Oh my gosh, that's that's manager material right now." Straight to the heart. Oh, yes. Yes. I

39:45
know. So true. In in family life and in your work life, management. Yeah. It's the same concept

39:50
where if if team members are coming and saying, "Hey, what can I do to help you?" And you're like, "Nothing. I got it. I got it. I got it." Well, then

39:57
they're going to stop asking to help eventually. And then also, um, they won't get the joy of that success of you

40:03
being able to hand something to them. So just always having things ready to be able to delegate whether it's tiny or

40:09
big. If they come to you, you're like, you know what, you're just the person and I do have something that I really need help with today. It may not be a

40:16
forever thing. It may just be something today, but then they get the joy of helping, which I think is really important. So

40:21
absolutely. Yeah. Okay. Any other thoughts that you have on this subject matter?

40:27
Oh my gosh. I'm sure. [laughter] But I feel like it was a lot of really good

40:33
like key things that I feel like I heard you say is um number one trust.

40:39
Delegation takes trust and it also takes expecting that they're going to make mistakes. So you got to create a a good

40:46
path to be able to give them feedback when they make those mistakes. Not if, but when. Um encouraging them like finding things

40:53
that they're being successful in and verbally encouraging those. um looking for people that have the right work

41:00
ethic. Even if they're still making m some mistakes as you try to train them on things, if they have the desire to do

41:05
a really good job, a really good work ethic and attitude, that goes a long way. And give them time,

41:11
100%. Um, and then also don't be a manager that closes yourself off, but be

41:17
out among your people working and and connected and having those open lines of

41:24
communication, being willing to step in wherever you're needed as a manager, which then creates this collaborative

41:30
feeling of them being able to step in, too. Yeah. Be a servant leader, you know?

41:36
Yeah. Just help out where it's needed, and then they're going to want to do the same for you. Yeah, agreed.

41:42
So many good tips. Why did it take me three years to get you back, Amanda? I feel like I ramble sometimes. So,

41:49
[laughter] if your if your listeners can follow along, just stick with it. It's good content.

41:55
I can guarantee you every manager and practice owner for that matter is taking notes right now. So, um I think these

42:01
are fantastic tips. And again, you've been doing it a long time. You're still doing it. You're not burned out. Not

42:07
that you don't have hard days, but so many managers burn themselves out for not delegating. So, I would say if

42:14
nothing else, this is a really good reminder to all managers who are listening to take some advice from

42:20
Amanda and figure this whole delegation thing out so that you can last longer in

42:25
this challenging field. Well, and you'll be happier, too, in the end. Yeah. you know. So, yeah, take some

42:32
stress off of your plate, delegate it out, and then you're not going to, you know, be

42:37
fizzle out. Yeah. Be so grumpy. I think that that too, like I can remember, sorry, I know

42:43
we were ending the podcast, but I can remember like just being so stressed out that I would snap at my team members.

42:51
And I'm not really like that anymore because I know that I have people that can help me and they're capable and

42:57
they're willing and they're trustworthy. Um, so yeah, last words of

43:03
advice. Advice from Amanda. If you're snapping at your team members, you're probably overwhelmed. Yeah, you're overwhelmed

43:08
and stressed and you need to delegate some task. And if you don't know whether or not you're snapping at your team members,

43:14
ask them. They may just tell you. Correct. [laughter]

43:19
Well, thank you for taking time out today to chat with me and our listeners. I know they will appreciate it. Good to

43:25
have you back. Thank you for having me. Thanks for joining the conversation today. We hope that you are comforted in

43:32
knowing that you are not alone, but we also hope that you're walking away with some [music] really great tips and

43:38
tricks to try in your practice. We value [music] your feedback, so

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